Urban Science and Harris Poll Release New Auto Shopper Survey Featuring EV Insights

Brian Pasch0:00Hi, this is Brian Pasch, and welcome to another exciting podcast interview today. We're going to do a deep dive into the Urban Science research in conjunction with the Harris Poll to really understand where the consumer mindset is in regards to their car purchasing journey, affordability, and what's going on with EVs and hybrids in the consumer's mind. Each year, Urban Science partners with the Harris Poll to put out some really effective research that dealer groups and 20 groups can use to really facilitate strategic planning, sales strategy adjustments, and more importantly, learn where the consumer is to sell more cars in the digital age. In order to help us understand the data, we're going to talk with two leaders.

Brian Pasch1:02Eric DeMont, he is the global product director for Urban Science, and Tom Kondrat, he's the global lead for their analytics team. And I am excited to have these two gentlemen on because we want to dive into the data and make some sense of it, and more importantly, to help you apply this data in the dealership. So Eric, Tom, welcome to the show.

Eric DeMont1:28Thanks for having us, Brian. Excited to be here.

Brian Pasch1:31So let's start off with affordability. You know, I was listening to the news just recently, and the doom and gloom about tariffs and trashing the economy really hasn't played out yet. And more importantly, we saw dealers have a little pull-ahead effect, I think, in March and April when the tariffs were first announced. And now I think we're trying to get back to understanding, are the consumers concerned about tariffs? Is affordability still the number one concern? Eric, let me start off with you. What is the survey data showing about consumer mindset and affordability?

Eric DeMont2:15Well, it's been pretty consistent. Tariffs certainly are topical right now. They're on, they're off, they're bigger, they're smaller. But affordability has been the top concern for consumers in the marketplace when thinking about purchasing or leasing a vehicle for almost 24 months. Tariffs certainly can exasperate that. But by 20 percentage points or more, affordability has been at the top of the mind of anyone purchasing or leasing a vehicle.

Brian Pasch2:48And Tom, when we hear about affordability as a top concern, how does the knowledge of this fact, really, that this is a key priority for consumers? How can dealers weaponize this data and actually use it in their sales strategy?

Tom Kondrat3:07Mm-hmm. Knowing that affordability is the top concern, dealers can use their tools at their disposal, whether it's through creative financing, whether it's through trade-in, you know, used car prices are up. So there's a lot that the dealers can do with trade-ins, with financing, you know, because it's a holistic, it's a holistic way to approach, you know, financing is to get all of the, you know, the tools at their disposal put on the table for the consumer. And the second most important thing that dealers can do in addition to pricing and affordability is transparency. So when they're laying out the trade-in, the financing, and all of that, being transparent with consumers has been

Tom Kondrat3:58a top three issue for at least the last 20 years. And sometimes that doesn't get talked about enough, but that's part of the equation in meeting consumer demand.

Brian Pasch4:12You know, when I talk to dealers, they say, well, I want more leads, I want more leads. I mean, it's just, I want more leads. And yet, when I look at the VDP pages on dealership websites, you know, it's like, get today's price, what's your trade worth, and calculate your payments. Obviously, the payments button is aligned with affordability, but it doesn't seem like the page is really maybe crafted to give them some assurance that the dealership will help them through their affordability journey. Like Tom was saying, there's a lot of tools and levers we can pull. I'm not sure if the VDPs are really telling the story, like we're here to help you find the most affordable path

Brian Pasch5:05forward. So I think there's a gap. There's a gap between what dealers want, what consumers are struggling with. How do we narrow that gap?

Eric DeMont5:12That's a great question. There's a bunch of different ways to kind of think through that. The first one, I would remind everyone that while affordability is a top concern, consumers are still buying. Tom can talk through the details in a moment. But if you look at SAAR, if you look at leads, people are still buying. And one of the biggest, you mentioned disconnects. One of the biggest disconnects that we're seeing is that like 93% of dealers that we surveyed think that consumers are going to change their buying patterns based upon this crisis of affordability. Only 50% of consumers are saying the same thing. So dealers are thinking that consumers are much more

Eric DeMont5:55price sensitive than they really are, at least as it relates to buying vehicles. Consumers have been very, very resilient in terms of their purchase intent. It doesn't mean that they're not price sensitive, expensive, but it does mean that they're still buying. So what does that mean? It means we have to execute the basics brilliantly because price is going to be a way of disqualifying dealers from a consumer standpoint that aren't providing the information that the consumers are looking for. Whether it be transparency and pricing, as you guys mentioned, or frankly, just being able to respond with details of a vehicle. When we talk about Brilliant Basics, shoot, at MRC, we hear the mystery shops all the time. You

Eric DeMont6:41have them go up on stage, they call a dealer, and they ask for price, and everyone's praying it's not their dealership, and they're not going to say, "This vehicle costs this."

Brian Pasch6:46Yeah, Cassie from CarWars does a great job with that.

Eric DeMont6:50Phenomenal job. And I think in the last MRC, the BDC agent that she got did a phenomenal job by not answering just the price question, but then starting to inquire around what are the needs of that consumer, and then aligning those needs with the advantages of the vehicle and how to position that. So the Brilliant Basics are the sales skills that we've been preaching in the industry for 30 years, but they become much more important when consumers are a little bit more price sensitive or price conscious. They're still buying, but we need to address their needs in a way that don't disqualify us from that opportunity.

Brian Pasch7:29You know, Eric, we weren't going to talk about SalesAlert, but I want to throw a point in here. My brother Glenn is on the road working with dealers in sales process, and here we are in in 2025, and sales associates or BDC teams are still dropping the ball with lead follow-up. And one of the things I wanted to just insert here, because consumers have an affordability concern, and you said it, they're still buying. And I want to just challenge dealers without going down a rabbit hole. The SalesAlert and TrafficView products will tell a dealer which consumer in their CRM has bought a car and and

Brian Pasch8:23what did they buy? And was it from a same same OEM brand or a different OEM brand? And I bring this up because if we get in the mindset that we're guessing intent or the seriousness, no one's going and submitting a lead accidentally or that they're bored. And it's so amazing to see when you can match lead opportunities to lost sales. And then here's what you find out. There's a group of salespeople that are just not trained properly. You just said about the basics. And I want to encourage dealers who are frustrated with their closing rates or frustrated that they're not penetrating or growing their market share as they

Brian Pasch9:08should. Those products will help them understand if there's a training problem or there's a process problem or a pricing problem or a, you know, communication issue. In today's world, it's super important. You know, Tom, as the global lead for analytics at Urban Science, I'm really fascinated with this kind of pivot the marketplace with EVs and hybrids. The Urban Science Harris Poll has a tremendous amount of data, which I want to dive into because there's some dealers that have EVs sitting on their lot. Certain markets in the US are doing better job with EV sales. The political turmoil with Tesla has really changed maybe some momentum from that company. So let's step back for a minute. What's

Brian Pasch10:03happening in consumers mindset in regard to EVs or hybrids? Maybe was Toyota the most brilliant by not jumping 100% into the EV craze when everyone else was all in. Now, you know, hybrids seem to be the middle ground. What are you seeing in this research?

Tom Kondrat10:21The EV market has been a roller coaster this year. In Q2, EV sales, when we say EV, I'm talking specifically battery electric to start with. So battery electric vehicles were down about 8% in Q2. But the national story is really Tesla. Because of all of Elon Musk's, you know, foray into politics, that's really turned off the traditional EV buyer. And that's opened the door for basically all the other brands to come in and take share away from the long time market leader, which is Tesla. And so Q2 EV sales were down nationally, but all other brands excluding Tesla, they were up. And even in July now, July, we're seeing that roller coaster zoom upwards

Tom Kondrat11:16again. And now EV sales are up in July, so far, month to date, as consumers are realizing the federal incentives are really only going to be available through the end of September. And now you can qualify for US-made vehicles with interest rate deductions. And so you kind of have the benefit of two different administrations and their tax policies. So there's a lot to follow. It's a very dynamic market. And all that points to is that the dealers should be using every tool at their disposal, including tools like SalesAlert and TrafficView to really master that market and keep tabs on it. Because every month this year has

Tom Kondrat11:58been a different story.

Brian Pasch12:00Eric, let's dive into that a little bit more. Obviously, Tesla has been losing sales to other manufacturers. I know, for example, in Canada, Hyundai's done very well with their EV line. If it's not Tesla, Tesla, Eric, who's doing the best job in getting consumers attention for EV models?

Eric DeMont12:25You know, I think we're going to go back to Tom for an answer on the brands that performing well. But before we do, what I wanted to mention is that while EV sales are up, close rates are also up and defection rates are up. Consumers are shopping at a rate that they haven't been shopping in a long time. I think that goes back to affordability. They want one, two, three more quotes than typically been getting because price is a concern. But to our point before, they're still in the marketplace. They're still buying. They're just shopping more, which again, goes back to the importance of doing

Eric DeMont13:01the basics brilliantly. Tom, though, why don't you chime in with who's doing the basics brilliantly from a market share standpoint?

Tom Kondrat13:09Yeah, you know, Chevrolet and Cadillac have really done very well this year with their EV strategy. You know, GM has jumped over the hybrid development and they went straight to battery electrics and that's been their strategy. And I have to say this year, it seems to be paying off because the GM brands that offer electrified vehicles have really significantly grown. In fact, Chevy's number two for for EV so far this year in retail. Yeah. And so but you look at Toyota and Honda strategy and you have to say they've done well, too, because they've appealed to consumers that have more range anxiety and those types of things with their with their hybrid offerings. And they've been doing

Tom Kondrat13:58very well in California, for example, as consumers have left Tesla, they've been looking for something a little bit more or less controversial, let's say. And so Toyota, Honda, very, you know, well-known brands in the state of California. So a lot of consumers have been shifting there. So a state by state, location by location, it's a very different story. And that's what makes it interesting.

Brian Pasch14:19You know, a friend of mine for their, let's say, 20 something child said, hey, for $299 a month, I was able to lease a Tesla, I think it was a 24 month lease, some money down. And their point was, is, wow, that's a really affordability, you know, conscious number. Do you think that Tesla, Tesla, Tom, has more price elasticity that, regardless of the politics, and let's just say the cloud around Tesla from the political foray, do you think if Tesla lowered prices, had more of an aggressive leasing, they win that back pretty quickly?

Tom Kondrat15:06I think the typical battery electric consumer has, you know, is paying attention to what Musk has been doing politically. And I think over time, as you know, things, if he backs off of that, you know, approach, I think you'd find Tesla coming back, especially being aggressive with their pricing. When we've seen Tesla offer those kinds of aggressive leasing deals, we've seen their market share rise pretty considerably. But I think, you know, the other brands now are offering very attractive vehicles. They're getting down into lower price points. They're expanding their range. They're offering consumers lots of options in different segments. And that is really helping to broaden the appeal.

Tom Kondrat15:57Slower than anticipated, you know, a couple of years ago, but it still is marching on. And it will be an interesting story what happens when that federal incentive backs off in October.

Brian Pasch16:08So, Eric, you spend a lot of time with dealers and dealer groups looking at their sales strategy, looking at the SalesAlert and TrafficView data, helping them see where their sales process is broken, how to retain more existing customers or prospects. What would you tell a dealer who's sitting on, they're not in California, they're not in one of the states that, you know, have more charging availability. Eric, what would you tell a dealer, you know, who's sitting on models that aren't moving? They have to the end of December to lock in these credits. Is there any wisdom you could share? Because I know in some markets, dealers are just saying, Brian, these models just aren't

Brian Pasch16:57moving. Other than doing dealer trades to California or, you know, Arizona or something, what's the, what's the strategy, Eric, that you may, you know, consider sharing? Because obviously the, the market for BEVs is, is really a regional, you know, story.

Eric DeMont17:19Um, so there's a couple of things I'm going to give one answer. Then I think Tom would like to chime in too, especially as we talked to groups about inventory allocation within groups based upon buying patterns. Um, but as consumers shop, as vehicles become more expensive consumers sensitivity to price increases, their shopping patterns increase, and they do, they submit more leads. What dealers need to know is they don't need to be blind as to the status of those, uh, of all the leads who haven't yet purchased in their CRM. By working with us, they, they would be able to know that those leads defected. But why that's important is once you know that they're affected, now you can remove them from

Eric DeMont18:01your followup process and insert them into either a elongated branding strategy or even a service campaign. Whether it be for traditional ICE vehicles or for electric vehicles, both of those have had, um, we've worked with dealers who have a lot of successes by taking the data that we've updated within their CRM or frankly, even sent to their CDP and then started to execute programs that are relevant to those consumers, no longer about buying the vehicle, trying to convince them to buy a vehicle that they've already purchased, but instead about servicing or branding or buying the next vehicle that might not be electric because they have range anxiety about having two electric vehicles in the

Eric DeMont18:44garage and they want to buy a nice vehicle the next time. So that, that was one of the key findings that we've come to recently as we've, as we sent this data to a variety of platforms. But I know Tom has different thoughts too, or additional thoughts.

Brian Pasch18:58Yeah. And, and, and, you know, before we go to Tom, Eric, I just want to say that, um, Urban Science will also be releasing a survey tool. And when someone defects to getting that immediate feedback on why we've done some manual surveying, you know, at the Vera automotive group down in, uh, Miami, we've done some surveying with Weiler. We've done some, uh, survey with a few other companies and 50% of the consumers who bought elsewhere said they would consider servicing their vehicle with a dealership. So, um, that's why I like today's data-driven sales, sales strategies. It's not just about winning and losing, but if you lose, how do you adjust your sales process and how do you generate

Brian Pasch19:46revenue? Tom, I heard some conflicting stats and, you know, it just popped in my mind about the percentage of people who bought a BEV, like, let's just say they bought a Tesla. They were early adopters. Do we have any data on what percentage of those people buy a second BEV? Or is it a high percentage of the people who, Hey, I tried the Tesla. I like it, but you know, maybe it's range, maybe it's charging. They move, uh, to a hybrid, any, any thought process, because I think dealers would like to know, like they could target Tesla owners, but what are they going to target

Brian Pasch20:32them with? Is it 50% stay or 50% leave? What, what, what can you tell the dealers who are listening in about the people who've bought a BEV? Are they, are they more likely to buy another one?

Tom Kondrat20:48In, in, in the data that we see, we see that BEV buyers tend to have multiple vehicles in their garage. So it's, it's, it's unusual that it's a, it's a one car kind of household. Generally it's there's the BEV is their second or third car. What we're seeing in the macro data is that when the BEV owners return to market, they're not interested in the ICE. They're much more interested in the hybrid, plug-in hybrid, something of that variety. And it's not necessarily always to replace it. It's, you know, generally adding to the fleet, but, um, we're seeing that in spades on the west coast, in California, Washington, Oregon, um, that a lot of those folks that early adopted, bought a Tesla,

Tom Kondrat21:32they're, they're opting for that hybrid option on the second purchase, you know, the, the following the battery electric vehicle. So there's a lot of opportunity there that those owners don't have to be strictly BEV. They tend to have a diverse fleet with different powertrains.

Brian Pasch21:43You know, for me and my mindset the other day, I, I had a rental car. It was a Mazda and it was a hybrid. And, and I liked when I was just cruising around local town, 25 miles, it was quiet. It was, you know, it had that EV, you know, kind of cool responsiveness. And then when I got on the highway, you know, and, and ripping, you know, the ICE engine kicked in, that makes more sense. I think Toyota was so smart. Uh, many of the OEMs made huge multi-billion dollar promises or commitments for battery factories or this or that. And some of those, some of those have been rolled back. Um,

Brian Pasch22:27is that where do you think we're going to end up? Um, because, you know, there are dealers here who are trying to figure out what their buying strategy is for the fall into next year. You know, should they be limiting their BEV inventory and, and kind of beefing up like is the hybrid, the middle chunk and on the edges are your ice vehicles and your BEVs. What, Tom, what do you think the stocking model or forecasting would look like in the future?

Tom Kondrat22:57Yeah. I love to work with those dealers on those kinds of questions because they're great questions. And the answer is, is it depends on where you are.

Brian Pasch23:08Hmm. Good.

Tom Kondrat23:08If you're in a major metro market, usually high tech sector, white collar, you know, some folks working from home, shorter commutes, they tend to be much more interested in those electrified options. If they're suburban owners, maybe they have families, you know, um, they're, they're very busy. They don't, they don't have time to think about, you know, charging inconveniences or that kind of thing, or maybe they're, they don't have charging at home. Um, so it's going to depend location by location and urban science can help, you know, targeting because it's a, it's a very dynamic problem state by state, you know, the state of Colorado, for example, has a $3,500 state incentive. Um, but that will only

Tom Kondrat23:56apply to plug in hybrids and battery electric. So, um, it depends on where you are really.

Brian Pasch24:02Great. You know, it's funny. My son, Connor, who works with me, does our video editing and podcast editing. I called him the other day and I'm like, where are you? He says, uh, I'm charging my Tesla, you know? And I joke with him because his apartment complex, he can't put a charger, you know, in, you know, uh, the complex. So there's a mall nearby, you know, it's one mile away. And in my brain, I'm like, this is kryptonite to me that I would have to sit in my car for 30 minutes to charge. Now for him, it does, it doesn't bother him. It's a different generation. So I could see,

Brian Pasch24:41um, you know, that people who are in apartment complexes probably need something like a hybrid, um, because of the, you know, if they're on the go all the time, you know, not too many people want to sit in their car for 30 minutes and, and charge up. Eric, could you tell the dealers who are listening in how the Urban Science team can help, um, coach their sales strategy, their stocking strategy, or even, um, come out to their 20 group and, and present this data to give dealers a more data driven approach for their, um, mix and messaging for the upcoming year?

Eric DeMont25:18Yeah, for sure. So you think about this affordability crisis that's been going on for 24 months, tariffs just kind of give it a shot in the arm and make it even more dynamic. Um, but even tariffs are not all about price. Tariffs are also about inventory because now some manufacturers aren't sending vehicles in and so they're harder to get. And when we polled consumers and dealers about their concerns, as it relates to tariffs, dealers understood that inventory was going to be an issue. Only 10% of consumers associated tariffs with inventory challenges.

Brian Pasch26:03Good point.

Eric DeMont26:03So it's time to dust off the COVID playbook. Unfortunately, the good news is most of us still remember it might still be on the shelf somewhere. We need to dust it off and remember that as we engage with consumers who are shopping more and more leads are coming in, we really need to seek to understand their need, the consumer's needs and make sure that we're helping that helping lead them to an answer that matches a vehicle we have in inventory. Because if we don't, we're going to run into the same challenges we had previously, but there's going to be it at this stage in the game, there's going to be another dealer with that car in stock and we're going to lose that up

Eric DeMont26:43unless we proactively and preemptively start talking about inventory at the beginning as we assess the shopper's needs and try to get them into the store for a conversation.

Brian Pasch26:56So good. You know, Tom, as you look over all the research that was just recently published and we're going to provide a QR code for dealers to just scan and request the poll and survey data. Tom, what did we miss? What was one thing that jumped out of this research this year that you think is really important for dealers to know?

Tom Kondrat27:21Yeah, I think that the changes to federal policy are really going to throw things up in the air and there's going to be a lot of changes. And, you know, we've talked a lot about the federal rebate going away in October. There's also changes, for example, to the CAFE standards. You know, we haven't heard as much about that, but that will change how manufacturers profit from their vehicles that will affect pricing and availability and all of that. So I think the takeaway is how dynamic the industry will be this year. It will be a very interesting time to see what happens. And, you know, the dealers that are the most agile, that have the best data,

Tom Kondrat28:12that use the best tools, that have the best processes, are the dealers that will survive and thrive in this dynamic time.

Brian Pasch28:18Well, gentlemen, this has been a great conversation to just understand all of the insights. And we only covered 20% of the data in this survey. Otherwise, we'd be here for about two hours. But the whole survey report is available for download. So I just want to encourage everyone, if you scan this QR code, you'll be able to go to a landing page. And there's two things. You can request a report. You can also request someone from the Urban Science team to talk to your general managers or even see if there's accommodations to come out and speak at a 20 group. Because I believe that a more

Brian Pasch29:03data-driven approach to sales strategy and business strategy is the way we need to move. And the team at Urban Science is really a specialist in OEM data and retail sales data. And of course, there are products we mentioned, SalesAlert and TrafficView are really indispensable tools for today's smart retailer. Eric, I'm going to let you close. What's one thing you want to tell dealers who are listening in about this urban science Harris Poll study and the future of automotive retail?

Eric DeMont29:37You know, I would say embrace it. We talked about vehicle affordability as being the top concern. Concern number two, cost of insurance. Concern number three, cost of maintenance. Let's be proactive out front with the messaging. As we set up our campaigns, as we set up our talk tracks for our sales teams. Let's address those head on. Let's message about vehicle maintenance assistance. Let's message about insurance recommendations. Let's message about free oil changes. Let's get that concern off the table and then get into addressing the vehicle needs of the consumer and matching them to the vehicles we have in stock and working to close the deal. If we try to run from it, if we try to ignore it, if we

Eric DeMont30:25just rely upon one simple price out there and bring the consumers in and assume that will cover all their concerns, I think that's missing the mark a bit. We have to adjust the gambit of their concerns, message against those, and have the opportunity then to have a deeper conversation with them.

Brian Pasch30:41That's great. And I want to challenge all the dealers here. You heard three concerns from consumers who have been recently polled. Do you have answers to those concerns that have been updated that your BDC and sales associates use? I mean, inspect it. And then more importantly, shouldn't you know what model they bought, who they bought it from, and when? Doesn't it make sense for you to do a health check on your current sales process, on those word tracks, on the effectiveness of communicating value? This is all something you can get from the TrafficView and SalesAlert products from Urban Science. So I want to encourage you on that same QR code, if you want to get a demo of these two products, as I mentioned, my brother

Brian Pasch31:39Glenn's out helping dealers and dealer groups with this tool, and they all are saying the same thing. We never had real-time insights on defection, and we never had a playbook on how to deal with it. So survey data helps us understand what are concerns and challenges in the marketplaces that should influence our sales process. And then we should make sure our sales process is working. That's the partnership that Urban Science is bringing to tier three for dealers who really want to sharpen their tracks and make sure every swing they're really being as efficient as possible to cut through the noise and sell more cars in a digital age. Thank you so much, gentlemen, for spending time with me and our

Brian Pasch32:21dealer community on this latest poll survey. And I look forward to seeing you and the whole Urban Science team at the Modern Retailing Conference November 16th, 17th and 18th in Palm Beach, Florida. It's the conference to attend. If you want to talk about modern retail strategy, the tools, the techniques, the process, the checks and balances that can really help elevate your sales and grow your market penetration. All of these topics and more, including how AI is transforming retailing will all be covered at the Modern Retailing Conference. So just go to modernretailingconference.com. Get your tickets today. Thanks so much for listening in. And if this is the first time you're listening to one of my

Brian Pasch33:07podcasts, there are hundreds of interviews online. Just search for the Brian Pasch podcast. Have a great day and look forward to seeing you next time on another exciting podcast interview.